共和国总统唐纳德·特朗普的私人律师鲁迪·朱利安尼告诉美国广播公司新闻，在他即将到来的第二次任期内，他将作为总统辩护团队的一员弹劾他准备争辩说，总统关于广泛的选民欺诈的指控并不构成煽动暴力，因为被广泛揭穿的指控是真实的。

朱利安尼告诉美国广播公司首席新闻记者乔纳森·卡尔:“我现在就参与其中……这就是我正在做的。”。

几小时后，朱利安尼——他领导了总统推翻2020年的努力选举结果——在白宫被发现。

朱利安尼参与特朗普的弹劾辩护之际，许多参与总统第一次弹劾的律师，包括白宫律师帕特·西坡隆(Pat Cipollone)和他的副手，以及外部律师杰伊·塞库洛(Jay Sekulow)和简·马蒂(and Marty Raskin)，都不打算返回二审。

朱利安尼和特朗普一起在1月6日的会议上发表了讲话集合在国会大厦袭击之前，他敦促人群进行“战斗审判”集会后，支持特朗普的支持者游行到国会大厦，强行进入大楼，试图阻止国会议员认证当选总统乔·拜登的总统选举，导致包括一名国会警察在内的五人死亡。

朱利安尼说，关于总统应该如何处理他的第二次弹劾，有“不同的意见”。

这位前纽约市市长说，为了替总统辩护，他将提出广泛的选民欺诈指控，这些指控在全国数十个法庭上被提出并被驳回。

“他们基本上声称，任何时候[特朗普]说选民欺诈、选民欺诈——或者我说，或者任何人说——我们都在煽动暴力;他说:“这些话是自相矛盾的，因为完全不真实。“嗯，如果你能证明这是真的，或者至少足够真实，所以这是一个合法的观点，那么他们就不再争吵了。”

吉姆·博格/路透社，档案

照片:唐纳德·特朗普总统的私人律师鲁迪·朱利安尼以特朗普支持者的身份发言

他还表示，他个人认为特朗普应该立即驳回审判。

“如果他们决定对其进行审判，他应该动议驳回弹劾，因为这是完全非法的。朱利安尼告诉美国广播公司新闻:“这是两天、三天内唯一一次弹劾。”。“我们会对法庭说，‘你现在允许在未来，基本上在两天内，国会可以对他们想弹劾的任何事情进行弹劾。"

上周，众议院投票弹劾特朗普，所有民主党人和10名共和党成员投票指控总统煽动支持者冲击美国国会大厦，这是一项历史性举措。

“美国总统煽动了这场针对我们共同国家的起义，这场武装叛乱。他必须离开，”众议院议长南希·佩洛西在众议院说。"他对我们热爱的国家是一个明显的、现实的威胁。"

众议院第三号共和党领袖、众议员利兹·切尼(Liz Cheney)是投票指控总统的10名共和党人之一。切尼发表了一份严厉的声明，谴责总统在投票前的行为，他写道:“美国总统召集了这群暴徒，聚集了这些暴徒，点燃了这次袭击的火焰。接下来的一切都是他做的。没有总统，这一切都不会发生。”

朱利安尼驳回了指控特朗普煽动暴力反对政府的弹劾条款的有效性，理由是总统的集会演讲没有煽动暴乱，因为演讲和袭击之间有延迟。

“基本上，如果(煽动)要发生，就必须马上发生，”他说。“你必须让人们离开，你必须让人们离开那个冷冰冰的演讲，直到国会大厦。这基本上就是煽动，”朱利安尼说。

如果驳回弹劾条款的努力失败，这是可能的，朱利安尼说，他不排除总统作证。特朗普的律师反对他在第一次弹劾审判中作证，但朱利安尼说，这种情况不同，弹劾辩护“要简单得多”。

“你总是在最后一刻做出决定，”朱利安尼说。“作为一名律师，我不会像当时那样强烈反对他作证。”

接近总统的消息人士最近告诉美国广播公司新闻，特朗普对朱利安尼越来越恼火，一直没有接他的电话，但他现在似乎仍然非常参与关于如何处理弹劾审判的讨论。

特朗普在任的最后几天仍存在的一个大问题是，他可能会发布哪些赦免令，以及他是否会试图赦免自己，特朗普告诉顾问，他愿意这样做，尽管没有总统这样做过。据知情人士透露，白宫法律顾问帕特·西坡隆(Pat Cipollone)建议特朗普不要自我赦免，部分原因是他认为这种赦免在法庭上站不住脚。

朱利安尼拒绝透露他给总统关于赦免自己的建议，但他告诉美国广播公司新闻，他的个人观点是这是完全合理的。

“我想任何一位律师都必须告诉你，宪法中没有允许这样做的条款。宪法里没有禁止的。宪法的简单语言并没有限制我们可以赦免谁，”朱利安尼说。“因为我们所处的环境，我认为有理由这样做吗?实际论证?绝对。”

朱利安尼驳斥了特朗普的一些顾问的担忧，即自我赦免将使特朗普更容易受到未来民事诉讼的影响，因为这将被视为认罪。

朱利安尼告诉美国广播公司新闻，“我的意思是，无论如何，他的法律生活都会很复杂。”。“也许是因为我更像是一名刑事律师，而不是民事律师，所以我宁愿让我的民事生活比刑事生活复杂。”

Giuliani says he's working on Trump's impeachment defense, would argue voter fraud claims

PresidentDonald Trump'spersonal attorney Rudy Giuliani tells ABC News he's working as part of the president's defense team in his upcoming secondimpeachmenttrial -- and that he's prepared to argue that the president's claims of widespread voter fraud did not constitute incitement to violence because the widely-debunked claims are true.

"I'm involved right now … that's what I'm working on," Giuliani told ABC News Chief White House Correspondent Jonathan Karl.

A few hours later, Giuliani -- who led the president's efforts to overturn the 2020electionresults -- was spotted at the White House.

Giuliani's involvement in Trump's impeachment defense comes as many of the lawyers involved in the president's first impeachment, including White House counsel Pat Cipollone and his deputies and outside lawyers Jay Sekulow and Jane and Marty Raskin, do not plan to return for the second trial.

Along with Trump, Giuliani spoke at the Jan. 6rallyahead of the Capitol attack, where he urged the crowd to engage in "trial by combat." Five people, including a Capitol Police officer, died when pro-Trump supporters marched to the Capitol following the rally and forced their way into the building in an effort to keep members of Congress from certifying the presidential election for president-elect Joe Biden.

Giuliani said there are "different opinions" regarding how the president should approach his second impeachment.

The former New York City mayor said that in his defense of the president, he would introduce allegations of widespread voter fraud that have been raised -- and rejected -- in dozens of courtrooms across the country.

"They basically claimed that anytime [Trump] says voter fraud, voter fraud -- or I do, or anybody else -- we're inciting to violence; that those words are fighting words because it's totally untrue," he said. "Well, if you can prove that it's true, or at least true enough so it's a legitimate viewpoint, then they are no longer fighting words."

He also said that he personally believed Trump should move to dismiss the trial outright.

"If they decide to bring it to a trial, he should move to dismiss the impeachment as entirely illegal. That it was the only impeachment ever done in what, two days, three days," Giuliani told ABC News. "We would say to the court, 'You are now permitting in the future, basically in two days, the Congress can just impeach on anything they want to."

In an historic move last week, the House of Representatives voted to impeach Trump, with all Democrats along with 10 Republican members voting to charge the president with inciting supporters to storm the U.S. Capitol.

"The president of the United States incited this insurrection, this armed rebellion, against our common country. He must go," House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., said on the House floor. "He is a clear and present danger to the nation that we all love."

Rep. Liz Cheney, the No. 3 Republican in House leadership, was among the 10 Republicans who voted to charge the president. Cheney issued a scathing statement condemning the president's actions ahead of the vote, writing, "The president of the United States summoned this mob, assembled the mob, and lit the flame of this attack. Everything that followed was his doing. None of this would have happened without the president."

Giuliani dismissed the validity of the single article of impeachment accusing Trump of inciting violence against the government on the grounds that the president's rally speech did not incite the riot because there was a delay between the speech and the attack.

"Basically, if [incitement] is going to happen, it's got to happen right away," he said. "You'd have to have people running out, you'd have to have people running out of that frozen speech, right up to the Capitol. And that's basically, incitement," Giuliani said.

If the effort to dismiss the impeachment article fails, which is likely, Giuliani said he wouldn't rule out the president testifying. Trump's lawyers were opposed to him testifying during his first impeachment trial, but Giuliani says this situation is different and the impeachment defense is "much more straightforward."

"You always make that decision at the last minute," Giuliani said. "As a lawyer, I wouldn't be as strongly opposed to his testifying as I was then."

Sources close to the president had recently told ABC News that Trump had been increasingly irritated with Giuliani and had not been taking his calls, but he now appears still very much involved in the discussions about how to handle the impeachment trial.

One of the big remaining questions about Trump's final days in office is what pardons he may issue and if he will attempt to pardon himself, something Trump has told advisers he would like to do even though no president has ever done so. White House Counsel Pat Cipollone has advised Trump against a self-pardon, in part because he does not think such a pardon would hold up in court, according to sources familiar with the conversations.

Giuliani declined to say what advice he has given the president about pardoning himself, but he told ABC News that his personal opinion is that it's perfectly justified.

"I think any lawyer would have to tell you there's nothing in the Constitution that permits it. There's nothing in the Constitution that prohibits it. The plain language of the Constitution doesn't limit who we can pardon," Giuliani said. "Do I think there's justification for it because of the atmosphere we are in? Practical justification? Absolutely."

Giuliani dismissed concerns of some Trump advisers that a self-pardon would make Trump more vulnerable to future civil lawsuits because it would be seen as an admission of guilt.

"I mean his legal life's gonna be complicated no matter what," Giuliani told ABC News. "Maybe because I'm more of a criminal lawyer than a civil lawyer, I'd much rather have my civil life complicated than my criminal life."