在过去的几天里，数百名移民试图穿过美墨边境在得克萨斯州，作为第42条的未来，特朗普时代在疫情开始时下令实施的边境限制受到质疑。
美国广播公司新闻的马特·里弗斯在边境接受了采访"从这里开始"周一谈到了这种情况，以及下周可能废除的这项法令会如何影响移民人数的增加。
Migrants travelling in a caravan of more than a thousand people from countries such as Nicaragua, Peru, Ecuador, Colombia, Venezuela and the Dominican Republic cross the Rio Bravo river (or Rio Grande river, as it is called in the US) to ask for political asylu...Show moreundefined
herika Martinez/法新社
从这里开始:马特，你报道移民问题已经很多年了。像你现在看到的这种景象有多不正常?
马特·里弗斯:我们现在所在的地方，我正看着埃尔帕索市中心的天际线，我所看到的是边境墙下的数百名移民。这很少见。在过去的几年里，我们已经看到大量的移民最终到达了边境的其他地方，数百人同时到达。例如，人们会记得，在2021年，有成千上万的海地移民最终来到了一个叫做阿库纳城的地方，这个地方就在德克萨斯州德里奥的边境对面。但是在埃尔帕索市中心的边境上有这么多的移民基本上是前所未有的。
我已经来到边境的这个地方很多年了，就在边境的这个地方，很多人经常从这里穿过，因为格兰德河在这里很低，我从来没有见过这样的事情。当我们在周日晚上到达时，我们看到了数百名刚刚一次过马路的人。
这是一群在过去几周聚在一起的人。我们不知道所有这些人是如何聚在一起的，但我们知道的是，他们是周日乘坐公共汽车来到华雷斯的。因此，主要是这些数百人的团体同时抵达华雷斯，他们集体做出决定，就像许多大篷车经常发生的那样……一次全部穿越。所以基本上，这是我第一次在这个特殊的过境点看到...数百人决定立即过河。这实际上很快就压倒了海关和边境保护官员相对有限的移民设施。
他们一次只能处理一定数量的人，所以你看到数百人在排队。他们已经在那里呆了一天多了。边境巡逻人员优先考虑妇女和儿童。他们先被处理，然后是单身男性。[他们]要么在美国等待其他移民程序期间被选择性释放，要么被带到边境其他地区的其他边境巡逻设施。因为，简单地说，我们现在所在的埃尔帕索地区，已经被到达那里的移民数量所淹没。
从这里开始:这是移民政策辩论的关键最后期限吗?第42条是在疫情时期实施的政策，基本上使我们在移民到达时更容易将他们驱逐出境。这种情况应该很快就会消失。我想知道，这是否改变了穿越边境的人群类型?
里弗斯:很有可能。我是说，每个人。当我说每一个人的时候，我的意思是每一个人都和我在墨西哥边境华雷斯这边交谈过的人有相同的观点。他们说，由于这项政策的结束，将会出现的人数可能会大幅增加。
这是特朗普政府时期实施的一项政策。它实际上是一项健康政策命令。这是一项指令，允许美国出于公共健康原因，立即驱逐来自美国的人，来自美国的移民，否则他们将获得庇护案件或至少庇护听证会。这种情况一直持续到2020年。根据几个悬而未决的法庭案件，第42条政策有可能最早在下周终止。这是移民都知道的事情。所以我们看到的移民在过去的36个小时内就已经过境了，他们并没有等待这项政策的结束。
我曾亲自与边境这边的六名移民交谈过，他们是许多其他人的代表，他们说他们正在等待第42条可能在下周结束。
从这里开始:哦，比如12月22日，我要穿越?
里弗斯:没错。十二月二十二日。这是我的一天，或者甚至可能是21日，每当裁决下来，他们就离开庇护所;他们要去美国申请庇护。所以我们今天看到的人群下周可能会更多。这是边境。我们不能肯定地说什么，但这肯定是一种可能性，也是两国人民正在计划的事情。
A look at the rise in migrants at the border as Title 42's future remains unclear
In the last couple of days, hundreds of migrants have been trying tocross the U.S.-Mexico borderin Texas, as the future of Title 42, the Trump-era border restriction ordered at the beginning of the pandemic, is in question.
ABC News' Matt Rivers, who is at the border, spoke with"Start Here"Monday about the situation and how a possible repeal of the order next week could affect the rise in migrants.
START HERE: Matt, you've covered immigration for years. How abnormal is a sight like the one you're looking at?
MATT RIVERS: Where we are right now, which I'm literally looking at the downtown skyline of the city of El Paso, what I'm seeing, is hundreds of migrants beneath the border wall here. That is unusual to see. We've seen large groups of migrants end up in other parts of the border over the last few years, with hundreds of people arriving at once. For example, people will remember, in 2021, there were thousands of Haitian migrants that ended up in a place called Ciudad Acuna, which is right across the border from Del Rio, Texas. But to have this many migrants here on the border in downtown El Paso essentially is relatively unprecedented.
I have come to this part of the border for years now, this exact spot on the border [and], many people often cross here because the Rio Grande is quite low here, and I've never seen anything like this. When we arrived on Sunday evening, we saw hundreds of people who had just crossed all at once.
This was a group of people that had gotten together over the last several weeks. We don't know exactly how all of these people managed to come together, but what we do know is that they arrived here in Ciudad Juarez on Sunday using buses. So mainly these groups of hundreds of people arrived in Ciudad Juarez all at the same time, and they collectively made a decision, as is often what happens in a lot of these caravans…to cross all at once. And so basically, for the first time that I've seen at this particular border crossing...hundreds of people decided to cross the river at once. And what that did was effectively overwhelm, very quickly, the relatively limited migrant facilities that Customs and Border Protection officials have.
They can only process a certain amount of people at a time, and so you saw hundreds of people in line. They've been there for more than a day now. Border Patrol agents are prioritizing women and children. They get processed first, [and] single males then thereafter. [They're] either going to be selectively released pending other immigration proceedings in the United States, or they will be taken to other Border Patrol facilities along other parts of the border. Because, simply put, the El Paso sector right now, where we are, is just overwhelmed by the number of migrants that are arriving there.
START HERE: Is it this key deadline coming up in the immigration policy debate? Title 42 is this policy that was implemented during the pandemic that basically made it easier for us to boot migrants out of the country when they arrive. That's supposed to be going away soon. I'm wondering, is that changing what types of crowds are going to be crossing the border?
RIVERS: It very well might. I mean, every single person. And when I say every single person, I mean every single person has the same opinion that I've spoken to here on the Ciudad Juarez side of the border in Mexico. They say that the amount of people that are going to be showing up because of this policy ending is going to grow perhaps substantially.
This was a policy that was put in place during the Trump administration. It is actually a health policy order. It's a directive that allows the United States for public health reasons to immediately expel people from the United States, migrants from the U.S., who otherwise would be granted asylum cases or at least asylum hearings. And that has been in place now going back to 2020. There's a possibility, depending on a couple of court cases that are pending, that the Title 42 policy will be ending as soon as next week. And this is something that migrants know about. So the migrants that we've seen cross already in just the last 36 hours, they're not waiting for that policy to end.
I have personally spoken to a half dozen migrants on this side of the border, and they're representative of many other people who say they are waiting for Title 42 to end potentially next week.
START HERE: Oh, like Dec. 22nd, I'm going to cross?
RIVERS: Exactly. Dec. 22nd. That's my day, or maybe even on the 21st, whenever that ruling comes down, they're leaving the shelter; they're going across and they're going to apply for asylum in the United States. So the crowds that we're seeing today could be even greater next week. It's the border. We can't say anything for sure, but that is certainly a possibility and something that people on both sides of the border are planning for.
