作为认罪协议的一部分，一名前总统唐纳德·特朗普的代理律师告诉佐治亚州的检察官，她在2020年大选后被告知唐纳德·特朗普“不会离开”白宫——尽管事实上他已经输掉了大选和随后的大部分挑战。
这一发现，连同其他信息，是在律师詹娜·埃利斯与富尔顿县调查人员的一次秘密面谈中披露的。美国广播公司新闻频道(ABC News)获得了埃利斯和西德尼·鲍威尔(Sidney Powell)提供会议的部分视频，这两位律师曾帮助特朗普推翻选举。这些视频首次披露了自上个月在地方检察官办公室同意合作以来他们告诉执法部门的细节选举干预案.
埃利斯在她的陈述中告诉检察官，特朗普白宫高级官员丹·斯卡维诺(Dan Scavino)告诉她，尽管输掉了选举，但“老板”将拒绝离开白宫，并提到了她所说的与检察官“相关”的另外两个例子——但由于律师-客户特权，似乎被阻止披露ABC新闻获得的视频部分中的内容，这阻碍了她的部分陈述。
与此同时，鲍威尔向检察官解释了她在全国范围内没收投票机的计划，并声称她在努力推翻2020年大选期间经常与特朗普沟通-尽管现在两人都声称她从来没有做过他的律师。
在会议中，鲍威尔重申了特朗普赢得选举的错误断言——但在视频中承认，她一开始就不太了解选举法。
“我了解选举法吗?没有，”她告诉富尔顿县检察官。“但作为一名10年的检察官，我理解欺诈，并且知道如果证据显示出我所认为的那样，欺诈诉讼应该是什么样的。”
富尔顿县地方检察官的发言人没有回应置评请求。当ABC新闻联系到埃利斯和鲍威尔时，他们的律师拒绝置评。斯卡维诺也没有回应置评请求..
詹娜埃利斯读一份声明后，埃利斯认罪的重罪指控，协助和教唆虚假陈述和著作，内富尔顿高等法院法官斯科特麦卡菲的富尔顿县法庭在亚特兰大，乔治
约翰·巴泽莫尔/普尔/美国环保署-埃菲社/Shutterstock
特朗普在富尔顿县案件中的首席律师史蒂夫·萨多(Steve Sadow)在给美国广播公司新闻(ABC News)的一份声明中称，埃利斯所说的“所谓的私人谈话”是“绝对没有意义的”。
“这条毫无意义的调查路线的唯一突出事实是，特朗普总统于2021年1月20日离开白宫，回到佛罗里达州棕榈滩的Mar-a-Lago，”萨多说。“如果这是达·威利斯打算依赖的那种伪造的、荒谬的‘证据’，那就又多了一个必须驳回这一政治性的、嘲弄性的案件的理由。”
作为认罪协议的一部分，认罪协商通常是在被告与执法部门会面时进行的，目的是披露对检察官有帮助的信息。美国广播公司新闻获得的视频似乎没有描述埃利斯和鲍威尔的完整会议，而是似乎是近一个半小时的摘录。在视频的某一点上，检察官指出鲍威尔在她的会议中回答了“三个小时的问题”。
特朗普和其他18人在8月份对所有指控进行了无罪辩护全面的敲诈勒索起诉涉嫌试图推翻佐治亚州2020年总统选举的结果。埃利斯和鲍威尔，以及其他两名被告，已经同意认罪，减少指控，避免坐牢，以换取他们在案件中的合作。
这位前总统抨击富尔顿县地方检察官法妮·威利斯的调查是出于政治动机。
“我们将继续掌权”
埃利斯一度是特朗普最忠诚的助手之一，他频繁出现在电视上和高调的立法会议上，在2020年大选后散布选举欺诈的虚假指控。根据联邦选举委员会的记录，特朗普竞选团队在2019年至2021年期间总共向她支付了近19.5万美元的法律服务费用。
在检察官10月23日与埃利斯会面的视频中，她说，特朗普的白宫高级助手之一丹·斯卡维诺(Dan Scavino)据称在2020年大选后几周的白宫圣诞派对上“以激动的语气”告诉她，“老板在任何情况下都不会离开。”
埃利斯在提议的会议上特别指出，斯卡维诺的所谓评论是对她就他们在法庭上的选举挑战缺乏成功而道歉的回应，斯卡维诺在加入特朗普的第一次总统竞选之前，曾在特朗普公司为唐纳德·特朗普工作了几十年最高法院的损失这表明他们挑战选举的能力“基本上结束了”
“他用一种激动的语气对我说，‘好吧，我们不在乎，我们也不会离开，’”埃利斯谈到了据称是12月19日与斯卡维诺的谈话。“我说，‘你是什么意思?’他说‘嗯，老板’，意思是特朗普总统——每个人都理解‘老板’，我们都这么称呼他——他说，‘老板在任何情况下都不会离开。我们将继续掌权。"
埃利斯继续说道，“我对他说，‘嗯，你知道，事情不是这样的。’他说，‘我们不在乎。"
根据提供的视频，埃利斯告诉检察官，两人在派对期间都喝了酒，但她认为这并没有影响到斯卡维诺的明显心态或她对事件的记忆。
埃利斯还告诉检察官，在她看来，斯卡维诺在她提出最高法院的损失后立即提供信息的事实“向我表明，他是认真的，这是在推进他与老板讨论的一些事情。”
在提供的视频中，埃利斯向检察官提供的陈述与《纽约时报》的玛吉·哈伯曼(Maggie Haberman)今年早些时候的报道相呼应，她在她的书《信心人:唐纳德·特朗普的形成和美国的崩溃》(Confidence Man:The Making of Donald Trump and The Breaking of America)中报道，特朗普告诉助手，“我只是不会离开”和“我们永远不会离开”。
埃利斯的叙述说明了其中一个最具体的例子，现在已经直接交给了检察官——他们在整个交流过程中保持谨慎，不涉足受律师-客户特权保护的领域。
美国广播公司新闻撰稿人、前佐治亚州检察官克里斯·蒂蒙斯(Chris Timmons)表示，埃利斯的证词可能最终会在审判中帮助佐治亚州检察官——但证据可能不是“致命一击”，因为评论并非直接来自前总统。
“假设埃利斯女士在审判中坚持作证，她关于斯卡维诺谈话的证词将有助于该州证明其指控，即前总统与其他人合谋非法改变选举结果，”蒂蒙斯说。“但这些证据不是‘致命一击’，因为它不是直接来自前总统。”
鲁迪叫我书里的每一个名字
鲍威尔之后接受了她的认罪协议10月19日在佐治亚州，特朗普迅速在社交媒体上试图与鲍威尔保持距离。“尽管有与此相反的假新闻报道，甚至没有伸手询问特朗普竞选团队，鲍威尔女士不是我的律师，从来都不是，”特朗普在特朗普社交网站上写道。在她的认罪协议之前，鲍威尔通过她的律师还表示，她从未代表特朗普或他的竞选活动纽约时报举报。
尽管如此，鲍威尔在她提供的采访中描述了与时任总统特朗普的密切和反复接触，声称她经常接到特朗普的电话，询问他们推翻选举的最新情况-即使是在特朗普竞选期间公开保持距离2020年11月从她那里。
鲍威尔在她的陈述中回忆了与特朗普的一次对话，她在对话中向特朗普表示懊悔，“我们的案件都没有成功。”
“我们提交了我们的cert请愿书，但看起来对他的方向没有任何好处，”鲍威尔谈到她的法律挑战。"他一直想知道在发现可能会改变选举结果的舞弊方面情况如何。"
鲍威尔还列举了她与特朗普、他的高级顾问和竞选团队的多次会晤，包括她对2020年12月18日在白宫椭圆形办公室举行的臭名昭著的会议的看法，据称特朗普和他的顾问在会上讨论了查封投票机作为他们竞选努力的一部分。
鲍威尔说，特朗普“特别愿意任命我为特别顾问”——这一举动将赋予她实质性的法律权力。“事实上，他三次看着(白宫法律顾问帕特)齐波洛内说，‘我有权任命她为特别法律顾问吗?’Cipollone说，‘是的，你有，’”她在视频中说。
“然后有人说，‘嗯，她没有安全许可，’”鲍威尔说。“所以他看着Cipollone说，‘我有权给她安全许可吗?’Cipollone说，'是的，你有'我想，在我们第三次经历这种情况时，奇波洛内说，“你可以给她起任何名字，总统先生，没有人会注意到这一点。”。"
鲍威尔在与调查1月6日袭击事件的众议院特别委员会的证词中讨论了12月18日的会议，她告诉委员会，她认为奇波洛内的评论意味着特朗普“没有得到他需要的法律顾问或他的工作人员的支持。”
特朗普的前国家安全顾问迈克尔·弗林和时任白宫办公厅主任马克·梅多斯也参加了椭圆形办公室的会议由消息来源描述争议很大。
在她的陈述中，鲍威尔表示，她认为特朗普希望她继续扣押投票机，并向检察官解释了她会如何做。
“我猜[特朗普]假设，我会认为，我会考虑实施13848条款，该条款允许在四五个州或城市保护机器，”鲍威尔说，他指的是特朗普考虑签署但没有签署的行政命令草案，该草案将赋予国家情报总监对任何表明外国政府或任何作为外国政府代理人或代表外国政府的人干预选举的信息进行评估的能力。
当被问及她将如何确定以哪些州为目标时，鲍威尔说，她将重点关注她认为有“统计异常”的州——尽管没有证据表明这种异常。
尽管鲍威尔告诉检察官，很明显她不会得到特别顾问的任命，但她说她仍然在第二天跟进了梅多斯。
“第二天早上，我打电话给马克·梅多斯(Mark Meadows)，只是为了弄清情况，然后问‘嘿，我什么时候能来拿我的徽章和钥匙?’”鲍威尔说他实际上是在笑——我的意思是他说，你知道，‘这不会发生的’。"
鲍威尔还回忆了与梅多斯和特朗普律师鲁迪·朱利安尼的额外会面，她和谁一起工作挑战选举结果，她说变得“非常丑陋”
“有一次大吵大闹，鲁迪把我骂得体无完肤，我是他一生中见过的最差劲的律师。在任何情况下他都不会和我合作。他骂我是婊子，我不知道他说了什么，这就是我所记得的全部了，”她说。
如果我是对的，他将继续担任总统
在讨论她与特朗普的直接对话和会晤时，鲍威尔在美国广播公司新闻频道(ABC News)获得的采访中告诉检察官，她从未听到特朗普承认他输掉了选举，即使在关键助手告诉他之后。相反，她说他是在跟随自己赢得的“直觉”。
“他所有的直觉告诉他，他被欺骗了，选举是一个大骗局，”鲍威尔说。"只是直觉告诉我这里有些不对劲。"
尽管如此，鲍威尔说，当多名顾问告诉他已经失败时，她在场，检察官追问鲍威尔，为什么总统听从她的建议，而不是他的其他顾问。
“因为我不认为他已经输了，”鲍威尔回答，后来说，“我看到了一条途径，如果我是对的，他将继续担任总统。”
前检察官蒂蒙斯还告诉美国广播公司新闻，鲍威尔会议的部分视频可能最终有助于辩护，因为鲍威尔似乎真诚地认为存在选举欺诈，并向特朗普传达了这一点。
“这些信息将有助于辩护，因为它支持了前总统认为他是合法行事的辩护，”这位前佐治亚州检察官说。
在1月6日国会大厦遇袭之前，鲍威尔说，她记得告诉“每个人，我需要离开华盛顿”，因为她“不认为这是一个好主意。”
“我只是认为在特朗普总统任期结束时举行集会是一个非常糟糕的主意。鲍威尔说，她在1月6日向众议院选举委员会提交的证词中做出了类似的评论。
鲍威尔在提供的视频中说:“事实上，有几个人本来计划来，我告诉他们不要来，但他们没有来。”
“与公众隔离”
埃利斯在陈述中还提到了另外两个她认为与检察官“非常相关”的例子，但在美国广播公司新闻频道获得的视频部分中，她似乎因律师-客户特权而被阻止透露细节，这妨碍了她的部分陈述。
第一个例子是她说她与另一名律师的私人谈话，当时朱利安尼在浴室里，两人在2020年12月初在佐治亚州举行的立法听证会上出现。正是在那次听证会上，朱利安尼推动官员改变选举结果，部分是通过指向一段视频，他谎称该视频显示选举工作人员鲁比·弗里曼和叶莎·弗里曼·莫斯改变了计票结果，后来赢了一场诽谤诉讼对抗朱利安尼。
关于二审，埃利斯告诉检察官，她认为关于所谓的假选举人阴谋的信息是故意向她隐瞒的。
“从本质上说，我的信念是，就实际发生的事情而言，我和普通公众都不知道，”埃利斯说，这是特朗普和他的盟友在七个关键的摇摆州策划的阴谋，他们制作并提交假证书，证明所谓的替代选举人，以确保特朗普在这些州的选举团胜利。
然而，在提供的视频部分，检察官阻止埃利斯详细谈论这些话题，指示她双方都不希望她谈论任何受律师-客户特权约束的谈话。因此，埃利斯没有提供这些互动的细节，这凸显了她有时在与检察官合作的能力方面受到限制的程度。
事实上，在美国广播公司获得的视频部分中，埃利斯从未讨论过她个人与特朗普的任何对话。
埃利斯在与检察官的谈话中时而公开时而不公开，相反，她只讨论了围绕这两起事件的背景，她不能透露，包括说她第一次从朱利安尼和现任特朗普顾问鲍里斯·爱普施泰因那里了解到假选举人阴谋的概念。
“鲍里斯发起了一个群[文本]线索，当时——这是我第一次知道——要求我加入一个电话，”埃利斯告诉检察官，检察官随后阻止她讨论电话的细节。
在她提出采访的第二天，埃利斯提交了她的认罪书在富尔顿县法院-告诉法庭，她后悔参与的努力，挑战选举。
“如果我当时知道我现在知道的，我会拒绝在这些选举后的挑战中代表唐纳德·特朗普，”埃利斯含泪告诉法官。"我带着深深的悔恨回顾这段经历。"
'The boss is not going to leave': Proffer videos show ex-Trump lawyers telling Georgia prosecutors about efforts to overturn 2020 election
'The boss is not going to leave': Proffer videos show ex-Trump lawyers telling Georgia prosecutors about efforts to overturn 2020 election
As part of a plea deal, one of former PresidentDonald Trump'sattorneys has told prosecutors in Georgia that she was informed in the wake of the 2020 election that Donald Trump was "not going to leave" the White House -- despite the fact that he had already lost the election and most of his subsequent challenges.
The revelation, along with others, came during a confidential interview the attorney, Jenna Ellis, had with Fulton County investigators. ABC News has obtained portions of videos of the proffer sessions of both Ellis and Sidney Powell, two attorneys who aided Trump's efforts to overturn the election. The videos for the first time reveal details of what they have told law enforcement since agreeing to cooperate last month in the district attorney'selection interference case.
Ellis, in her proffer session, informed prosecutors that senior Trump White House official Dan Scavino told her "the boss" would refuse to leave the White House despite losing the election, and alluded to two other instances she said were "relevant" to prosecutors -- but appeared to be prevented from disclosing those in the video portions obtained by ABC News due to attorney-client privilege, which hindered portions of her proffer.
Powell, meanwhile, explained to prosecutors her plans for seizing voting machines nationwide and claimed that she frequently communicated with Trump during her efforts to overturn the 2020 election -- though both now claim she was never his attorney.
In the session, Powell reiterated the false assertion that Trump won the election -- but acknowledged in the video that she didn't know much about election law to begin with.
"Did I know anything about election law? No," she told Fulton County prosecutors. "But I understand fraud from having been a prosecutor for 10 years, and knew generally what the fraud suit should be if the evidence showed what I thought it showed."
A spokesperson for the Fulton County District Attorney did not respond to a request for comment. Attorneys for Ellis and Powell declined to comment when reached by ABC News. Scavino also did not respond to a request for comment..
In a statement to ABC News, Steve Sadow, Trump's lead counsel in the Fulton County case, called the "purported private conversation," as described by Ellis, "absolutely meaningless."
"The only salient fact to this nonsense line of inquiry is that President Trump left the White House on January 20, 2021, and returned to Mar-a-Lago in Palm Beach, Florida," Sadow said. "If this is the type of bogus, ridiculous 'evidence' DA Willis intends to rely upon, it is one more reason that this political, travesty of a case must be dismissed."
Proffer sessions, which are often required as part of plea deals, occur when a defendant meets with law enforcement to disclose information that would be helpful to prosecutors. The videos obtained by ABC News do not appear to depict Ellis and Powell's full proffer sessions, but rather appear to be excerpts that total nearly an hour and a half. At one point in the videos, prosecutors indicate that Powell, in her session, answered "three hours of questions."
Trump and 18 others pleaded not guilty in August to all charges in asweeping racketeering indictmentfor alleged efforts to overturn the results of the 2020 presidential election in the state of Georgia. Ellis and Powell, in addition to two other defendants, have since agreed to plead guilty to reduced charges and avoid jail time in exchange for their cooperation in the case.
The former president has blasted Fulton County District Attorney Fani Willis' investigation as being politically motivated.
'We are just going to stay in power'
Ellis, who at one point was one of Trump's most loyal lieutenants, frequently appeared on TV and in high-profile legislative sessions spreading false claims of election fraud following the 2020 election. In total, the Trump campaign paid her nearly $195,000 for her legal services between 2019 and 2021, according to Federal Election Commission records.
In the video of prosecutors' Oct. 23 proffer session with Ellis, she said that one of Trump's top White House aides, Dan Scavino, allegedly told her "in an excited tone" at a White House Christmas party weeks after the 2020 election that "the boss is not going to leave under any circumstances."
Ellis specifically noted during the proffer session that the alleged comment from Scavino, who worked for Donald Trump for decades at the Trump Organization before joining his first presidential bid, came in response to her apologizing over the lack of success with their election challenges in court, culminating with aSupreme Court lossthat indicated their ability to challenge the election "was essentially over."
"And he said to me, in a kind of excited tone, 'Well, we don't care, and we're not going to leave,'" Ellis said of the alleged Dec. 19 conversation with Scavino. "And I said, 'What do you mean?' And he said 'Well, the boss', meaning President Trump -- and everyone understood 'the boss,' that's what we all called him -- he said, 'The boss is not going to leave under any circumstances. We are just going to stay in power.'"
Ellis continued, "And I said to him, 'Well, it doesn't quite work that way, you realize?' and he said, 'We don't care.'"
Ellis told prosecutors that both were consuming alcohol during the party, but that she did not believe that factored into Scavino's apparent mindset or her memory of the event, according to the proffer video.
Ellis also told prosecutors that in her mind, the fact that Scavino offered the information immediately after she brought up the Supreme Court loss "indicated to me that he was serious and that was in furtherance of something that he had discussed with the boss."
The account given by Ellis to prosecutors, as revealed in the proffer video, echoes earlier reporting this year from The New York Times' Maggie Haberman, who reported in her book, "Confidence Man: The Making of Donald Trump and the Breaking of America," that Trump had told aides, "I'm just not going to leave" and "we're never leaving."
Ellis' account illustrates one of the most concrete examples yet of one of those instances, which has now been given directly to prosecutors -- who were cautious throughout the exchange not to wade into areas protected by attorney-client privilege.
Former Georgia prosecutor Chris Timmons, an ABC News contributor, said that Ellis' testimony may ultimately assist Georgia prosecutors at trial -- but that the evidence might not be a "kill shot," given the comment did not come directly from the former president.
"Assuming Ms. Ellis testifies consistently at trial, her testimony about the Scavino conversation would help the State prove its allegation that the former President conspired with others to unlawfully change the result of the election," said Timmons. "But that evidence is not a 'kill shot' in that it didn't come directly from the former President."
'Rudy called me every name in the book'
After Powellaccepted her plea dealin Georgia on Oct. 19, Trump quickly took to social media to try to distance himself from Powell. "Despite the Fake News reports to the contrary, and without even reaching out to ask the Trump Campaign, MS. POWELL WAS NOT MY ATTORNEY, AND NEVER WAS," Trump wrote on Trump Social. Ahead of her plea deal, Powell through her lawyer, also said she never represented Trump or his campaign, TheNew York Timesreported.
Still, Powell described in her proffer interview being in close and repeated contact with then-President Trump, claiming that she frequently received calls from Trump asking for updates on their efforts to overturn the election -- even as the Trump campaignpublicly distanced itselffrom her in November 2020.
Powell, in her proffer, recalled a conversation with Trump in which she expressed remorse to Trump that "none of our cases were panning out."
"We were filing our cert petitions, but it wasn't looking good for anything to happen in his direction," Powell said of her legal challenges. "He always wanted to know where things were in terms of finding fraud that would change the results of the election."
Powell also listed multiple meetings she had with Trump, his top advisers and the campaign -- including her take on the now-infamous meeting held in the White House Oval Office on Dec. 18, 2020, in which Trump and his advisers allegedly discussedseizing voting machinesas part of their effort to contest the election.
Trump, said Powell, "was specifically willing to appoint me special counsel" -- a move that would have granted her substantial legal powers. "In fact, he looked over at [White House Counsel Pat] Cipollone three different times and said, 'Do I have the authority to name her special counsel?' and Cipollone said, 'Yes, you do,'" she said in the video.
"And then somebody said, 'Well, she doesn't have a security clearance,'" Powell said. "So he looked at Cipollone and he said, 'Do I have the authority to give her a security clearance?' and Cipollone said, 'Yes, you do.' And then about the third time we went through that scenario, Cipollone, I think, said, 'You can name her anything you want, Mr. President, and nobody's going to pay a bit of attention to it.'"
Powell, who discussed the Dec. 18 meeting in her deposition with the House select committee investigating the Jan. 6 attack, told the committee that she took Cipollone's comment to mean that Trump "wasn't getting the legal counsel he needed, or the support from his staff."
The Oval Office meeting, which was also attended by Trump's former national security adviser Michael Flynn and then-Chief of Staff Mark Meadows, has beendescribed by sourcesas highly contentious.
During her proffer, Powell said it was her belief that Trump wanted her to pursue the seizing of voting machines, and explained to prosecutors how she would have done it.
"I guess [Trump] assumed, and I would have thought, that I would have looked at putting into effect a provision of 13848 that would have allowed the machines to be secured in four or five states or cities," Powell said, referring to a draft executive order Trump considered signing, but did not, that would have given the Director of National Intelligence the ability to conduct an assessment of any information indicating that a foreign government, or any person acting as an agent of or on behalf of a foreign government, was interfering in the election.
When asked how she would have determined which states to target, Powell said she would have focused on states that she believed had "statistical anomalies" -- despite there being no evidence of such anomalies.
Though Powell told prosecutors it was clear she would not get the special counsel appointment, she said she still followed up with Meadows the next day.
"I called Mark Meadows the next morning just to run it to ground, and said, 'Hey, when can I come pick up my badge and my key?'" Powell said. "He essentially laughed -- I mean he said, you know, 'It's not going to happen.'"
Powell also recounted an additional meeting with Meadows and Trump attorney Rudy Giuliani,with whom she workedto challenge the election results, that she said got "really ugly."
"There was a big shouting match in which Rudy called me every name in the book and I was the worst lawyer he'd ever seen in his life. There were no circumstances under which he'd work with me on anything. He called me a bitch and I don't know what all, and that's pretty much all I remember about that one," she said.
'If I was right, he would remain president'
In discussing her direct conversations and meetings with Trump, Powell, in the portions of her proffer interview obtained by ABC News, told prosecutors that she never heard Trump concede that he lost the election even after being told by key aides that he had. Instead, she said he was following "instincts" that he won.
"All his instincts told him he had been defrauded, that the election was a big fraud," Powell said. "Just general instincts that something wasn't right here."
Still, Powell said she was present when multiple advisers told him he had lost, and prosecutors pressed Powell over why the president followed her advice instead of his other advisers.
"Because I didn't think he had lost," Powell replied, later saying, "I saw an avenue pursuant to which, if I was right, he would remain president."
Timmons, the former prosecutor, also told ABC News that the partial video reviewed of Powell's sessions could end up helping the defense, because Powell appeared to sincerely believe there was election fraud and communicated that to Trump.
"That information would be helpful for the defense in that it bolsters a defense that the former president thought he was acting lawfully," the former Georgia prosecutor said.
Ahead of the Jan. 6 attack on the Capitol, Powell said she remembered telling "everybody that I needed to get the hell out of D .C." because she "didn't think any of it was a good idea."
"I just saw it as a really bad idea to have a rally over the end of the Trump presidency. I just wouldn't have encouraged people," said Powell, who made similar comments in her deposition with the House select Jan. 6 committee.
"In fact, there are several people that had plans to come up that I told not to come, and they didn't come," Powell said in the proffer video.
'Shielded from the general public'
Ellis, in the proffer, also alluded to two other instances she said were "very relevant" to prosecutors -- but she appeared, in the portions of the video obtained by ABC News, to be prevented from disclosing the details due to attorney-client privilege, which hindered portions of her proffer.
The first instance was a private conversation she said she had with another attorney while Giuliani was in the bathroom after the two appeared at a legislative hearing in Georgia in early December 2020. It was during that hearing that Giuliani pushed officials to change the election results, in part by pointing to a video he falsely claimed showed vote counts being altered by election workers Ruby Freeman and Shaye Freeman Moss, who laterwon a defamation lawsuitagainst Giuliani.
Regarding the second instance, Ellis told prosecutors she believed that information about the so-called fake elector plot was intentionally kept from her.
"My belief, essentially, [is] that was shielded from me specifically, but also from the general public, as far as what was actually going on," Ellis said regarding the plot allegedly orchestrated by Trump and his allies in seven key swing states to produce and submit fake certificates certifying so-called alternative electors to secure Trump's Electoral College victory in those states.
However, in the portions of the proffer video, prosecutors stopped Ellis from going into detail on either of those topics, instructing her that neither side wanted her to speak about any conversations that would be subject to attorney-client privilege. Ellis, as a result, did not provide details of those interactions -- highlighting the extent to which she appeared to be constrained at times in her ability to cooperate with prosecutors.
In fact, in the portions of video obtained by ABC, Ellis never discussed any conversation she personally had with Trump.
Ellis, who in her remarks alternated between speaking on and off the record with prosecutors, instead discussed only the context surrounding the two incidents she couldn't divulge, including saying that she first learned about the concept of the fake electors plot from Giuliani and current Trump adviser Boris Epshteyn.
"There was one group [text] thread that Boris initiated when -- which was the first time that I learned of it -- asking me to just join a phone call," Ellis told prosecutors, who then stopped her from discussing the details of the call.
A day after her proffer interview, Ellisentered her guilty pleain Fulton County court -- telling the court that she regretted her involvement with efforts to challenge the election.
"If I knew then what I know now, I would have declined to represent Donald Trump in these post-election challenges," Ellis tearfully told the judge. "I look back on this experience with deep remorse."
