在宣传他新书的采访中，“叛徒:在我们分裂的国家捍卫民主和自由前伊利诺伊州众议员亚当·金辛格告诉记者538政治播客主持人盖伦·德鲁克，“我很乐意和特德·克鲁兹竞选。”他继续说，“像他们中的一个那样，政治上最彻底的骗子，能够在公共场合与他的脸对抗，将是令人惊讶的。”
金辛格澄清说，他目前没有这样做的计划。参议员克鲁兹将在2024年竞选连任，并面临德克萨斯州众议员科林·奥尔雷德(Colin Allred)的民主党挑战者。如果克鲁兹赢得连任，他的席位将在2030年再次上升。
金辛格最近从伊利诺伊州搬到了休斯顿，他详细阐述了自己挑战克鲁兹的愿望:“我很想，但现在，我没有能力。你知道，我有一个年轻的孩子。我已经从过去几年中走了下来。但是如果某个时刻到来并且时机合适。是啊，绝对是。”
他还建议民主党支持像他这样的人作为德克萨斯州的全州候选人是明智的:“如果你是一个聪明的民主党，你会把像我这样的人作为你的候选人，对吗?你会让他们通过初选，因为，对不起，(前众议员贝托·奥罗克)不会赢得德克萨斯州。如果你得到一个保守的民主党人，你可能会赢得德克萨斯州。”
以下是金辛格采访德鲁克的精选、略加编辑的摘录:
538政治播客主持人盖伦·德鲁克:如果你不同意我的观点，你可以告诉我，但我认为你今天赢得民主党初选比赢得共和党初选更容易。
伊利诺伊州前众议员亚当·金辛格:是啊，当然。嗯哼。
物品:那你会怎么做?你如何从党内(挑战特朗普)而不被共和党选民认作是民主党人?
AK:我认为，作为一名民主党人，编码可能只是我们现在所处的阶段的一部分，因为我认为，共和党真的不再基于任何原则。我们掌权时，真的不关心支出。他们现在突然喜欢上俄罗斯了。嗯，那不是我记忆中的共和党。现在他们想支持以色列，但前提是他们要削减美国国税局同等数额的资金。因此，如果你违背唯一的组织原则，可悲的是，共和党现在普遍是唐纳德·特朗普。他说什么就是什么，这就像是对他的承诺。所以，当然，如果你反对他，不管你的观点是什么，我的意思是，看看[前怀俄明州众议员]利兹·切尼有多保守，对吗?但你被编码为另一方，因为你在部落之外。你在法庭之外。
你如何改变这一点?你不会在接下来的一两个月内这么做。共和党很可能会继续失败。我想他们必须，继续输才能清醒过来。唐纳德·特朗普必须下台，不管是什么形式。然后必须有一个新的鼓舞人心的人出现并改变基调，共和党的罗纳德·里根或民主党的巴拉克·奥巴马，你知道，最初可以走上舞台辩论，每个人都喜欢，“我讨厌他。他是民主党人。”然后突然之间，也许他说得有道理了，也许他正带领我们走向一个更大的愿景。它不是自然发生的，而是在领导下发生的。
物品:你认为自己是民主党人吗?
AK:不，我没有。我仍然认为自己是共和党人。我称自己为无家可归的共和党人，因为我确实不觉得自己属于这个共和党。一旦我放弃共和党的头衔，显然我就失去了批评这个政党的能力。我的希望是，它回到我对共和主义的愿景。但是我认为在2024年的选举中有一个问题，只有一个问题，那就是民主。它是幸存下来，还是继续滑向独裁主义?所以，我可能会投民主党的票。并不意味着我是民主党人。
物品:我听说你已经在巡回签售会上说过，你会投票给拜登，而不是特朗普。
AK:我能看见你。那就是你要去的地方。
物品:你会投票给拜登而不是(前联合国大使妮基·黑利)吗?
AK:我不知道。这取决于，我非常喜欢妮基·黑利。我非常喜欢(前新泽西州长)克里斯·克里斯蒂。如果她真的能赢得初选，我可能会投妮基·黑利的票。我不喜欢妮基·黑利的什么?嗯，不是一吨，除了她不站着…我得到了它的政治。这就是全部。井
物品:被编码成另一个世界。
AK:是的，你必须，孩子你必须为唐纳德·特朗普辩护。但与此同时，这就像，这是他的持续防御，使他几乎，你知道，无懈可击。所以，是的，我当然会考虑她。但我想听听她对此有什么看法，因为，同样，正义、捍卫民主是最重要的事情。
—
物品:所以是什么阻止了你，我的意思是，我不得不说，你听起来像个民主党人。
AK:是啊。我的意思是，看，我认为一部分原因是我再也看不到一个非常健康的保守民主运动了，对吗?他们最后都被打败了。但是看，对我来说，我对大象没有任何个人感情。我一直称自己为共和党人。所以说不同的话会有点奇怪。但我相信我所相信的。如果民主党开始欢迎像我这样的人，你知道，我认为他们可以成为一个非常健康和充满活力的政党。但是，你知道，我是堕胎的温和派，但是我认为我是反堕胎的。如今在民主党中有这样的位置吗?我不知道。
—
物品:那么你现在的下一步是什么?
AK:现在，我不知道。我的意思是，我正在经历这种一年来看看，你知道，我们在过去几年里经历的一切都有影响。我用相当于，当你在战争中，没有人在战斗中有创伤后应激障碍，对吗?这是后来的事了，我没有创伤后应激障碍，但我感觉到了过去几年的影响。五个月前我会告诉你，我可能再也不想回到政坛了。个人认为，这种情况已经改变了。我又找到了那种能量。这不会很快发生，但我们会看到它从这里走向何方。
物品:会在哪个党?
[笑声]
AK:谁知道呢，伙计。
物品:好吧，那么-
AK:谁知道呢?
物品:我在你的书里读到你在休斯顿写这本书。
AK:没错。
物品:你会考虑换个状态去别处跑步吗?我想是的。
AK:老实说，我真的没有-
物品:德克萨斯看起来像是竞选公职的好地方吗?
AK:老实说，事实上和特德·克鲁兹竞选会很有趣。我没有那样做，让我们说清楚。但那会很有趣，对吧?我甚至不知道他什么时候起床。
物品:等等，等等，你一说出来就要踩我的新闻钉?
[笑声]
AK:我很想和特德·克鲁兹竞选，因为对我来说，这就像是政治中最，最彻底的骗子，像他们中的一个，能够在公共场合和他的脸竞选将是惊人的。但是
物品:但是听起来你很想去?
AK:我很想去，但是现在，我没有能力去。你知道，我有一个年轻的孩子。我已经从过去几年中走了下来。但是如果某个时刻到来并且时机合适。是啊，绝对的。
物品:六年后?
AK:有可能，是的。
物品:你认为你会留在德克萨斯吗?
AK:我不知道。我不知道。我们意外地决定留在德州。[笑]所以当威胁来的时候，我已经卖掉了我在伊利诺伊州的房子，我的地址就在那里。我的姻亲有一个他们不在的地方，在德克萨斯州，所以我们呆在那里，因为我们试图弄清楚接下来会发生什么，并且不想搬得太远。所以，我们最终在德克萨斯州买了房子。所以，现在，我们在那里。但是任何事情都可能发生。
物品:对于与你政见相同的人来说，他们会如何竞选德州的州级职位呢?
AK:嗯，我认为如果有人要像我这样做，我认为你想看的是，首先，如果你是一个聪明的民主党，你会把像我这样的人作为你的候选人，对吗?你会让他们通过初选，因为，对不起，贝托不会赢得德克萨斯。如果你得到一个保守的民主党人，你可以赢得德克萨斯州。如果你是共和党人，那就很难了。现在德州的派对相当疯狂。但我认为你必须诚实地参选，并尽可能多地争取非共和党人参加共和党初选。但我认为这很难。但是我还没有作出决定，我还没有根据未来十个月的政治动向作出决定，包括我是否会住在德克萨斯州。
物品:好吧。但是我可以拼凑出一些东西，你知道，你有没有在晚上睡觉的时候想过…
AK:号码
物品:哦，跑步会是什么样子...
AK:不，不是真的。
物品:...作为民主党人在德克萨斯对抗特德·克鲁兹?
AK:我是说没有，但是今晚我会的，因为你，就像，在我的脑海里。我就想，“啊?作为民主党人与特德·克鲁兹竞选会是什么样?”问题是，民主党会不会选举，你知道，你和自由民主党竞选，然后，你知道，你是亚当·金辛格类型的人，他们会选你吗?我不知道。我认为民主党在决策上比共和党更务实。
Adam Kinzinger muses: 'I would love to run against Ted Cruz'
In an interview promoting his new book, "Renegade: Defending Democracy and Liberty In Our Divided Country," former Illinois Rep. Adam Kinzinger told538 Politics podcasthost Galen Druke, "I would love to run against Ted Cruz." He continued, "the most complete con artist in politics, like one of them, to be able to run against his face in public would be amazing."
Kinzinger clarified that he has no current plans to do so. Sen. Cruz is up for re-election in 2024 and is facing a Democratic challenger in Texas Rep. Colin Allred. If Cruz wins re-election, his seat will be up again in 2030.
Kinzinger, who recently moved to Houston from Illinois, elaborated on his desire to challenge Cruz: "I would like to, but right now, I'm not in a position to. You know, I've got a young kid. I've got to kind of come down from the last couple of years. But if there's a moment that comes along and the timing is right. Yeah, absolutely."
He also suggested the Democratic Party would be wise to back someone like him as a statewide candidate in Texas: "If you're a smart Democratic Party, you'd put somebody like me as your candidate, right? You'd put them through the primary because, I'm sorry, [former Rep. Beto O'Rourke] is not going to win Texas. If you get a conservative Democrat, you could win Texas."
Below are select, lightly edited excerpts from Kinzinger's interview with Druke:
Galen Druke, host of the 538 Politics podcast:You can tell me if you disagree with me, but I think it would be easier for you to win a Democratic primary today than a Republican primary.
Adam Kinzinger, former Representative from Illinois:Yeah, for sure. Uh-huh.
GD:And so what do you do? How do you [challenge Trump] from the inside of the party without literally getting coded as a Democrat by Republican voters?
AK:I think the coding as a Democrat is probably just par for the course in the moment we're at right now, because the Republican Party, I would argue, really is not based on anything in principles anymore. There's really not a concern for spending when we were in charge. They like Russia all of a sudden now. Well, that wasn't the Republican Party I remember. Now they want to support Israel, but only if they cut the IRS by the same amount of money. And so if you go against the only organizing principle, sadly, in the GOP generally right now is Donald Trump. Whatever he says goes, it's like a commitment to him. And so, of course, if you oppose him, regardless of what your views are, I mean, look how conservative [former Wyoming Rep.] Liz Cheney is, right? But you get coded as the other side because you're outside of the tribe. You're outside of court.
How do you change that? You're not going to do it in the next month or two. The Republican Party is probably going to continue to lose. I think they have to, to continue to lose to wake up. Donald Trump's got to go away, in whatever form that is. And then there has to be a new inspirational person that comes along and changes the tenor, a Ronald Reagan for the Republicans or a Barack Obama for the Democrats that can, you know, initially go on that stage and debate and everybody's like, "I hate him. He's a Democrat." And then all of a sudden, maybe he's making some sense, maybe he's driving us to a vision that's bigger. It doesn't happen organically, it happens with leadership.
GD:Do you consider yourself a Democrat?
AK:No, I don't. I consider myself a Republican still. I call myself a homeless Republican because I certainly don't feel like I belong to this Republican Party. The second I give up the title Republican, obviously I lose the ability to, I think, very rightly criticize this party. My hope is, it returns to what my vision of Republicanism is. But I think there's one issue on the ballot in 2024, just one issue, and that is democracy. Does it survive or do we continue to slide to authoritarianism? So, I'll probably vote for a Democrat. Doesn't make me a Democrat.
GD:I've heard you already say on your book tour that you would vote for Biden over Trump.
AK:I could see you. That's where you were leading to.
GD:Would you vote for Biden over [former U.N. Ambassador Nikki Haley]?
AK:I don't know. And that's, um, it depends on, I like Nikki Haley a lot. I like [former New Jersey Gov.] Chris Christie a lot. If she actually could pull off winning in the primary, I'd probably vote for Nikki Haley. What are the things I dislike about Nikki Haley? Well, not a ton, except that she's not standing … And I get the politics of it. And this is that whole, like. Well-
GD:Getting coded as the other side.
AK:Yeah, you've got to, boy you've got to defend Donald Trump. But at the same time, it's like, it's the continuing defense of him which makes him almost, you know, invulnerable. So, yeah, I would certainly consider her. But I want to hear what she has to say about that, because, again, that justice, that defense of democracy is the most important thing.
—
GD:So what prevents you from just being, I mean, I got to say, you sound like a Democrat.
AK:Yeah. I mean, look, I think part of it is I don't see a very healthy conservative democratic movement anymore, right? They all end up getting beat. But look, to me, I have no, like, personal attachment to an elephant. I've always called myself a Republican. So it would be kind of weird to say something different. But I believe what I believe. If the Democratic Party starts welcoming people like me, you know, I think they can be a very healthy and vibrant party. But look, I'm, you know, a moderate on abortion, but I consider myself pro-life. Is there a spot for that in the Democratic Party today? I don't know.
—
GD:So what's next for you now?
AK:Right now, I don't know. I mean, I'm going through this kind of one year of taking a look at, you know, everything we went through in the last couple of years had an impact. And I use the equivalent of, when you're in war, nobody has PTSD in combat, right? It's afterwards, and I don't have PTSD, but I feel the impact of that last couple years. I would have told you five months ago that I probably never intended to get back in politics again. Personally, that's changed. I'm kind of finding that energy again. It's not going to be anytime soon, but we'll see where it goes from here.
GD:Which party will it be in?
[Laughter]
AK:Who the hell knows, man.
GD:Okay, so-
AK:Who knows?
GD:I read in your book that you were writing the book from Houston.
AK:Right.
GD:Would you consider changing states and running elsewhere? I imagine yes.
AK:Honestly, I haven't really-
GD:Does Texas seem like a good place to run for office?
AK:Actually it'd be kind of fun to run against Ted Cruz, to be honest with you. I'm not doing that, let's be clear. But it would be fun, right? I don't even know when he's up.
GD:Wait, wait, wait, you're going to step on my news peg as soon as you say it?
[Laughter]
AK:I would love to run against Ted Cruz, because that to me would just be, it would just be like the most, the most complete con artist in politics, like one of them, to be able to run against his face in public would be amazing. But-
GD:But it sounds like you would like to?
AK:I would like to, but like, right now, I'm not in a position to. You know, I've got a young kid. I've got to kind of come down from the last couple of years. But if there's a moment that comes along and the timing is right. Yeah, absolutely.
GD:In six years?
AK:Potentially, yeah.
GD:Do you think you'll stay in Texas?
AK:I don't know. I don't know. We made a decision kind of accidentally to stay in Texas. [Laughs] So I had sold my house in Illinois when the threats were coming in and my address was out there. My in-laws have a place they're not in, in Texas, so we stayed there as we tried to figure out what's next, and didn't feel like moving too far. So, we ended up buying a house in Texas. So, for now, we're there. But anything can happen.
GD:For somebody with your politics, how might they run for statewide office in Texas?
AK:Well, I think if somebody was going to do it like me, I think what you want to look at is, first off, if you're a smart Democratic Party, you'd put somebody like me as your candidate, right? You'd put them through the primary because, I'm sorry, Beto is not going to win Texas. If you get a conservative Democrat, you could win Texas. If you're a Republican running in that, it's tough. It's a pretty crazy party in Texas right now. But I think you just have to run honestly and put it out there and try to turn out as many not Republicans in the Republican primary as you can. But I think it'd be pretty hard. But I have not made a decision, and I haven't made a decision based on a future political move in like ten months, including whether I'm living in Texas or not.
GD:Okay. But I can sort of piece together, you know, have you stayed up at night ever thinking like…
AK:No.
GD:Oh, what would it be like to run ...
AK:No, not really.
GD:... As a Democrat in Texas against Ted Cruz?
AK:I mean no, but I will tonight now, because you, like, have it in my head. I'm like, "Huh? What would it be like to run as a Democrat against Ted Cruz?" The question is, would the Democrats ever elect, you know, you run against a liberal Democrat and then, you know, you're an Adam Kinzinger type, would they elect you? I don't know. I think Democrats are more pragmatic on that decision-making than Republicans are.
